Phil Denton 5-speed transmission (road use)

[Matain]

Gerry Cain, +44 207 236 0096, sells a kit advertised as, quote, "commissioned for myself" in the UK VJMC Autojumble. Could be the same kit?

Hi.

This post has been brought to my attention by a customer of mine with regard to the Honda 305 5 speed road ratio gear set. Having seen the post I would like to give the forum members my account and involvement with this products arrival in the market.

My name is Gerry Cain and I have and still do enjoy a good trading relationship with Nova racing in England. Several years ago I went to them for a five speed gear set for a Velocette Venom. It is not viable to make one set so I ordered ten at a time on the understanding that I would be the sole supplier of such. I have only ever sold the Velocette 5 speed gear set through my website http://www.velocettegearset.com/

To this date Nova have proved to be very honourable and upheld their end of this agreement. They are the first to agree that I have sold more of these gear sets than they would have themselves.

I believe the reason for the success I have had in selling these kits is that I actually fit and ride machines fitted with these kits, and take considerable time fielding and resolving fitting enquiries from customers and providing a positive aftercare service. Indeed one customer was so pleased he hosted a wonderful weekend in Germany for me! See Velocettegearset.com.

About 18 months ago I acquired a long lusted after Honda CB77. It was immediately apparent to me that the bike needed a five speed gear set. I again contacted Nova Racing and discussed this in great detail with them. I encouraged them to make 5 speed road ratio gear set kit on the understanding that I would have a similar agreement to that which existed with the Velocette.

Having ridden the standard bike at length, I was able to discuss the ratios I considered would be required and what customers would and would not expect for road use. Early this year I took my own empty crankcases to the Nova factory and fitted the five speed kit on the Nova benches. At the same time, I made amendments to Novas fitting instructions but from a layman's point of view.

Now was the time to promote the new gear set; I narrowly missed the closing date in the early
2010 edition of the VJMC but my advertisement appears now. I was surprised and disappointed to learn at this point that, Nova decided to market this gear set themselves together with another, especially after my considerable and continuous input. In hindsight If I had realised that I was not to have been the sole supplier of this set I would not have wasted my time and money on advertising and building the www.honda305gearset.co.uk/ website.

I am however, the first to have fitted and ridden with the five speed gear set and now, would modestly suggest, that I have more experience than Nova themselves with regard to the actual fitting. The kit is an excellent product and a credit to Nova's engineering skills . The ratios are exactly as required. The bike is how it should have been made in the first place and gets up to speed so much faster. There is a huge advantage with two people on as you do not have to over rev to get a move on. For solo use I have two teeth less on the rear wheel as one can easily drop to 4th to pick up speed.

Not wishing to take unfair advantage of the Honda forum I posted news and photos of these developments for the community in the forum over a year ago. I did not and do not want to use the forum as a commercial channel. My reason for the original post was that I felt that the new gear set would be of great interest to the members.

The bikes and pictures you see are mine and I believe demonstrates my passion and commitment. If you want to know more please contact me here or through my website.

[teazer]

NOVA used to supply their race kit transmission exclusively through Bernie Saunders who I understood to have been involved with NOVA and had an original 5 speed race kit trans.

A road set of ratios was worked out by Dennis Murfin (sp?) a while back and many of us including Pete Rhodes and myself kicked around different ratio options.

The point I'm trying to make is that many people have worked on the problem and my guess is that when NOVA decided to manufacture a road box, they may have felt that too many people had contributed in parallel and without any discussion to make one person a sole supplier.

That is speculation on my part and I have never discussed it with Graham Dyson directly or indirectly.

The 5 speed is one of many things that many people have worked on and proposed solutions. I considered having NOVA manufacture a batch for our sole distribution and decided it was not viable to do so.

I hope that you are able to sell many transmissions form your new web site.

[e3steve]

Considering the time & effort that you've contributed to the task, Gerry, I wish you the very best of luck in 'shifting' the trannies. I might consider one for my CB if I can convince myself that it doesn't kill off the nostalgic properties surrounding why I own it.

I'd imagine a 5-speed would especially (and immensely) benefit a Touring machine also!

[Matain]

Hi,

Thanks for your kind wishes.

I can see what you mean about changing the character of the bike but if you like it as it is, you will want to ride it at every opportunity with the 5 gears in.

I have updated my post of last Jan with pictures of the bike I have fitted the 5 speed gear set in and some more of the gearset itself.

[masonmart]

Scott

Phil had a CB77 motor with one of these transmissions in it along with a NOS crank at the recent Classic Motorcycle show in Stafford near my home.

It looked very good but I'd want a whole bike for that money. Bernard Saunders does a racing version. I'm think of building a 350 street bike with all of the goodies and stripped for lightness, so I'm collecting some nice engine parts in readiness.

G

I bought Denton's bike from him, the less said about it the better though. However, after throwing lots of money at it, in the end it was one of the best bikes I've ever owned. I had the 350 conversion done and put in big valves from Bernie Sanders. In addition to the Nova box it had duplex primary drive too (Nova plus the chain man) and it went like a train. The gearbox was the biggest weakness on the original bikes. It always needed an extra gear but it would have doubled the price of the bike apparently.

Ridiculous really because I already had a CB&& to the same high spec. It makes a very good bike into an absolute classic, it eats my CB450

[Snakeoil]

I'm reviving this thread because I'm curious if anyone has seen any action on these gearboxes lately. I lost all my email correspondence a year or so ago so I could not find any info. I had inquired with Gerry I believe (cannot remember for sure) and he told me he had one set left, but the price was a tad steep. I was inquiring for a CL77 conversion and am not sure if the CB gears will work in a CL. I found this thread because I was looking for the name of the company that made the gears because someone I know just trashed the rear end in their 1931 Indian Dispatch Tow and needs to have replacement gears and axles made.

I see that Nova was the firm that made the gears for the 305.

But I'm still thinking of putting a set in my CL77. The comment that the CB with a 350 kit, big valves and the 5 speed eats a CB450 got the juices flowing again.

Thanks,
Rob

[G-Man]

Rob

We also have Moore Performance Engineering in the UK but the web site doesn't seem to be working any more. He made duplex primary conversions for CB72/77 and also one-off replacement gears & shafts for all sorts of gearboxes.

G

I'm reviving this thread because I'm curious if anyone has seen any action on these gearboxes lately. I lost all my email correspondence a year or so ago so I could not find any info. I had inquired with Gerry I believe (cannot remember for sure) and he told me he had one set left, but the price was a tad steep. I was inquiring for a CL77 conversion and am not sure if the CB gears will work in a CL. I found this thread because I was looking for the name of the company that made the gears because someone I know just trashed the rear end in their 1931 Indian Dispatch Tow and needs to have replacement gears and axles made.

I see that Nova was the firm that made the gears for the 305.

But I'm still thinking of putting a set in my CL77. The comment that the CB with a 350 kit, big valves and the 5 speed eats a CB450 got the juices flowing again.

Thanks,
Rob