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CA77 Early Engine Question

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Dr. Frankenstein
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CA77 Early Engine Question

Post by Dr. Frankenstein » Mon Mar 19, 2018 4:29 am

I just picked up a 1963 CA77E, and this may sound weird, but it looks...smaller.

I have it parked right next to my 1968 CA77, and the new one is lower, and I swear the engine looks smaller - I haven't researched the engine or frame numbers yet, but did Honda ever put a 250 engine into a CA77E frame and call it a 305?

The tank on this Early model is badged 'Honda 305', and it looks original - but the bike just looks different, somehow.


Maybe it's just me...

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G-Man
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Re: CA77 Early Engine Question

Post by G-Man » Mon Mar 19, 2018 6:53 am

The engines (outside) are exactly the same set of castings apart from the cast in "247" or "300" at the bottom of the barrel. There were minor changes from early to late but nothing that would make it look bigger or smaller.

The tanks and seats are different from early to late and that may be affecting your perception.

Are you sure that it says 305 on the tank badge? Normally they say 300

Pictures, please....

G
Dr. Frankenstein wrote:I just picked up a 1963 CA77E, and this may sound weird, but it looks...smaller.

I have it parked right next to my 1968 CA77, and the new one is lower, and I swear the engine looks smaller - I haven't researched the engine or frame numbers yet, but did Honda ever put a 250 engine into a CA77E frame and call it a 305?

The tank on this Early model is badged 'Honda 305', and it looks original - but the bike just looks different, somehow.


Maybe it's just me...
'60 C77 '60 C72 '62 C72 Dream '63 CL72
'61 CB72 '64 CB77 '65 CB160
'66 Matchless 350 '67 CL77
'67 S90 '77 CB400F

Dr. Frankenstein
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Posts: 568
Joined: Tue Feb 02, 2010 7:11 pm
Location: Charlottesville, VA

Post by Dr. Frankenstein » Sun Mar 25, 2018 7:54 am

Yes, you are correct - it says '300'. It just looks different, I guess, what with its flat tires and covered in rust and dirt like it is...

I got it mostly just for the tank, which is one of those Early tanks with the cap in the middle, and it's in surprisingly good shape inside - and the rest of the bike is pretty much all there, except for the seat which was totally rusted down to the frame bolts, and the destroyed remnants of a windhield frame.

One side cover was gone, and the other covering the coils was pretty much rusted through, but the electrics are in surprisingly good shape too. Carburetor, filter cover and filter is there as well.

It has both mufflers in really good shape, but one of them is off it, with about the first two inches of header-pipe rust-welded to the interior of the muffler neck - the rest of the header is separated from the neck...any ideas how to get THAT out??

And, of course, it wont turn over because of rust issues, I'm sure. I have had the cylinders soaking in a soup of oil, Marvel Mystery Oil and PB Blaster, but its not budging - I'm open to ideas here as well, besides taking it out of the frame and doing a tear-down, which will have to wait as there are several projects ahead of it...I just want it to break free. Heat and force, maybe..?

No pics yet, but I'll see what I can do.

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G-Man
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Post by G-Man » Sun Mar 25, 2018 4:05 pm

John

Try mixing up a solution of Oxalic acid (wood bleach) and soak the muffler in it. Agitate every now and again. The acid will dissolve the rust and should help you to get that piece out.

G
Dr. Frankenstein wrote:Yes, you are correct - it says '300'. It just looks different, I guess, what with its flat tires and covered in rust and dirt like it is...

I got it mostly just for the tank, which is one of those Early tanks with the cap in the middle, and it's in surprisingly good shape inside - and the rest of the bike is pretty much all there, except for the seat which was totally rusted down to the frame bolts, and the destroyed remnants of a windhield frame.

One side cover was gone, and the other covering the coils was pretty much rusted through, but the electrics are in surprisingly good shape too. Carburetor, filter cover and filter is there as well.

It has both mufflers in really good shape, but one of them is off it, with about the first two inches of header-pipe rust-welded to the interior of the muffler neck - the rest of the header is separated from the neck...any ideas how to get THAT out??

And, of course, it wont turn over because of rust issues, I'm sure. I have had the cylinders soaking in a soup of oil, Marvel Mystery Oil and PB Blaster, but its not budging - I'm open to ideas here as well, besides taking it out of the frame and doing a tear-down, which will have to wait as there are several projects ahead of it...I just want it to break free. Heat and force, maybe..?

No pics yet, but I'll see what I can do.
'60 C77 '60 C72 '62 C72 Dream '63 CL72
'61 CB72 '64 CB77 '65 CB160
'66 Matchless 350 '67 CL77
'67 S90 '77 CB400F

Dr. Frankenstein
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Posts: 568
Joined: Tue Feb 02, 2010 7:11 pm
Location: Charlottesville, VA

Post by Dr. Frankenstein » Mon Mar 26, 2018 5:48 am

I see great results on steel, but it won't hurt the aluminum muffler, will it? I'll have to submerge the whole head-end for a *While...

It's the kind of rust that looks welded and in flaky layers; it's IN there, and the rusted off head-end is flush with the neck of the muffler.

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G-Man
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Post by G-Man » Thu Mar 29, 2018 7:20 am

Aluminum muffler?

They should be chrome-plated steel or stainless steel.

G
Dr. Frankenstein wrote:I see great results on steel, but it won't hurt the aluminum muffler, will it? I'll have to submerge the whole head-end for a *While...

It's the kind of rust that looks welded and in flaky layers; it's IN there, and the rusted off head-end is flush with the neck of the muffler.
'60 C77 '60 C72 '62 C72 Dream '63 CL72
'61 CB72 '64 CB77 '65 CB160
'66 Matchless 350 '67 CL77
'67 S90 '77 CB400F

Dr. Frankenstein
honda305.com Member
Posts: 568
Joined: Tue Feb 02, 2010 7:11 pm
Location: Charlottesville, VA

Post by Dr. Frankenstein » Thu Mar 29, 2018 7:26 am

It might be stainless, but aged so long it has an aluminum-like sheen to it.

I'm going to try your oxalic acid treatment today.

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