Dynojet A/F Meter

[brewsky]

I would think by now ya could have received more than one correct reply as to how to set a carb float.
My way is for the 305 carbs and not a PW22. ................lm

"""""""""""I do apologize for my obsession, but it is still there."""""""""" OK??????!!!!!!!!
Go ride the thing and if ya don't for some reason have knowledge of that other person (Ya can read tuning questions/problems) which ARE THE SAME AS YOUR CARB ISSUES) and is possible as to why I am OVERLOADED with the fact that a couple of the EXPERTS have offered info on the carb subject and ya act as tho ya don't understand.
CARBS are mechanical and as ya are able to read my description and then offer SO MANY pics and "I did this and that" I'd think by now ya would be able to SET THE FLOAT and go ride.
More on this forum than I are tired of this!!!!!!!!!!!!!!. ...........lm

OK!
Not saying ya " Need More Than a Simple Answer". HUH!
But ta me ya are "just as another" (member who has gone on to another bike) who seems to like to project ideas and show pics to do no more than continue a simple carb adjustment!!!!!!!!!
Will ya ever Get On The Bike And Ride It??????
Maybe there will be a future after all with those carbs!!!!!!!!!!!!!. ......lm

The notch in the PW22 carb body is there as when Yasshi installed the float and used the HONDA tool all carbs were correct and would work as designed.
Ya can bend the FLOAT Things to what if any angle ya like (by now many have been changed from issue) and as long as ya have the correct MM and tang correct the dern things WILL WORK.
Too much on this subject for me.
Just use YOUR BRAIN and less ????????????????????.
PLEASE. ..............LM

Bend the tab?. ......lm

Jensen,
Here are my measurements for both your parallel arm method and the line of sight method (at least as I understand them)

Note the measurements are taken from the carb body cutout and not the gasket surface.

Your parallel arm method, if measured from the gasket surface, gives very close to 26.5mm.

Closer measurement reveals there is a 2.2mm difference between the gasket surface and body cutout reference points.

Both are with float tang touching but not depressing the float valve.

LM,
I have bent the tab and tried it both ways, and it results in different float heights:

one .......26.5mm from cutout notch...(float lines up with jet holder)

and the other......26.5mm from the gasket surface.... (float below the jet holder, but float arm parallel with carb body)

There is a 2.2mm difference in the measurement starting point (cutout notch vs gasket surface) so there has to be the same difference in the float heights if you use the same spec distance for the measurement. (26.5mm for PW22 carbs)

In 2009, I asked what I thought was a simple question:
http://www.honda305.com/forums/viewtopi ... ight=float
Got an answer that I thought made sense and went with it.
Hundreds of posts later, the same question was getting asked and debated over and over.
Then e3Steve posted his sticky of how to make a carb guage, and my previous belief went all to pieces.
Answers like "just use the line of sight and don't worry about it", "just get the arm level with the body and don't worry about it", and "get the correct MM and tang correct" just don't answer the question.
There is at least 2.2 mm difference in float height depending on which answer to the question is correct, and if that difference is not significant, then I'll quit worrying about it.

LM,
I don't know what your issue with me or my posts are......but to answer your questions...

I don't know who you are referring to as the other member who moved on, but I haven't, and don't plan on it

I rode my Dream today, yesterday and the day before that, and have worn a new rear tire out in the past year or so. It is my favorite bike for short trips, and I do a lot of them.

I have learned a lot from this forum's members, and try to give back when I can, and pictures say a lot more than words in my opinion.

I don't claim to be an expert by any means, and I do try to learn something new every day.

I'm sorry you are tired of it, but no one is forcing you to read or reply.

Judging from the number of hits and replies to just this post subject, I don't think everyone else is either.

Whenever I think that my posts are uninteresting, uninformative, unappreciated, or tiring, I will gladly sign off this forum and ride off into the sunset.

In the meantime I will continue to ask questions about what I don't know, and offer opinions about what I do.

I'm sure I have received the "correct" reply, as I have read every post on the subject (hundreds of them)...and the replies differ mainly into 2 versions reagrding where to measure the specified float distance from .......carb body cutout or gasket surface.

By the way, my PW22 IS from a 305....and therein lies most of the problem...COMMUNICATION.

What I call "gasket surface", someone else may refer to as "cutout" or "notch"

When you said "My way is for the 305 carbs and not a PW22", I'm sure you didn't mean to imply that no 305 carbs are PW22

The reason I like pics is they leave less chance for mis-interpretation.

If you look at the last pics I attached, you will see that IF the specified 26.5mm for a PW22 is measured from the cutout notch on the sides of the carb body, THEN the line of sight method DOES WORK for a PW22 carb.....at least for the 2 I have which have identical jets, holders and floats.

You will also see in the other pic, the "parallel float arm" method works IF the specified 26.5mm is measured from the very bottom "gasket surface" (the one with the semi-circle bead that seals the gasket)

These 2 different interpretations result in a 2.2mm difference in float height, and I would rather start any adjustment from the level Honda recommended, than 2.2mm off.
I do know how to set a carb float, and have done many, and not just Hondas. And it does make it much easier when you know the correct spec for float height and where the measurement reference is.

The only expertise I have found in your replies to the PW22 carb float setting question has been: "I'm not sure", or "Yep, they are different", and "Ya wrong with this one feller",.......
although I'm sure you DO know

"PEACE"

[LOUD MOUSE]

A C/CA77 does use a PW22 but the CB/CL72/77 engines use a 26mm carb.
All my set up/tune up data is for the CB/CL77 and nothing to do with the C/CA77. ......lm

I would think by now ya could have received more than one correct reply as to how to set a carb float.
My way is for the 305 carbs and not a PW22. ................lm

"""""""""""I do apologize for my obsession, but it is still there."""""""""" OK??????!!!!!!!!
Go ride the thing and if ya don't for some reason have knowledge of that other person (Ya can read tuning questions/problems) which ARE THE SAME AS YOUR CARB ISSUES) and is possible as to why I am OVERLOADED with the fact that a couple of the EXPERTS have offered info on the carb subject and ya act as tho ya don't understand.
CARBS are mechanical and as ya are able to read my description and then offer SO MANY pics and "I did this and that" I'd think by now ya would be able to SET THE FLOAT and go ride.
More on this forum than I are tired of this!!!!!!!!!!!!!!. ...........lm

OK!
Not saying ya " Need More Than a Simple Answer". HUH!
But ta me ya are "just as another" (member who has gone on to another bike) who seems to like to project ideas and show pics to do no more than continue a simple carb adjustment!!!!!!!!!
Will ya ever Get On The Bike And Ride It??????
Maybe there will be a future after all with those carbs!!!!!!!!!!!!!. ......lm

The notch in the PW22 carb body is there as when Yasshi installed the float and used the HONDA tool all carbs were correct and would work as designed.
Ya can bend the FLOAT Things to what if any angle ya like (by now many have been changed from issue) and as long as ya have the correct MM and tang correct the dern things WILL WORK.
Too much on this subject for me.
Just use YOUR BRAIN and less ????????????????????.
PLEASE. ..............LM

Bend the tab?. ......lm

Jensen,
Here are my measurements for both your parallel arm method and the line of sight method (at least as I understand them)

Note the measurements are taken from the carb body cutout and not the gasket surface.

Your parallel arm method, if measured from the gasket surface, gives very close to 26.5mm.

Closer measurement reveals there is a 2.2mm difference between the gasket surface and body cutout reference points.

Both are with float tang touching but not depressing the float valve.

LM,
I have bent the tab and tried it both ways, and it results in different float heights:

one .......26.5mm from cutout notch...(float lines up with jet holder)

and the other......26.5mm from the gasket surface.... (float below the jet holder, but float arm parallel with carb body)

There is a 2.2mm difference in the measurement starting point (cutout notch vs gasket surface) so there has to be the same difference in the float heights if you use the same spec distance for the measurement. (26.5mm for PW22 carbs)

In 2009, I asked what I thought was a simple question:
http://www.honda305.com/forums/viewtopi ... ight=float
Got an answer that I thought made sense and went with it.
Hundreds of posts later, the same question was getting asked and debated over and over.
Then e3Steve posted his sticky of how to make a carb guage, and my previous belief went all to pieces.
Answers like "just use the line of sight and don't worry about it", "just get the arm level with the body and don't worry about it", and "get the correct MM and tang correct" just don't answer the question.
There is at least 2.2 mm difference in float height depending on which answer to the question is correct, and if that difference is not significant, then I'll quit worrying about it.

LM,
I don't know what your issue with me or my posts are......but to answer your questions...

I don't know who you are referring to as the other member who moved on, but I haven't, and don't plan on it

I rode my Dream today, yesterday and the day before that, and have worn a new rear tire out in the past year or so. It is my favorite bike for short trips, and I do a lot of them.

I have learned a lot from this forum's members, and try to give back when I can, and pictures say a lot more than words in my opinion.

I don't claim to be an expert by any means, and I do try to learn something new every day.

I'm sorry you are tired of it, but no one is forcing you to read or reply.

Judging from the number of hits and replies to just this post subject, I don't think everyone else is either.

Whenever I think that my posts are uninteresting, uninformative, unappreciated, or tiring, I will gladly sign off this forum and ride off into the sunset.

In the meantime I will continue to ask questions about what I don't know, and offer opinions about what I do.

I'm sure I have received the "correct" reply, as I have read every post on the subject (hundreds of them)...and the replies differ mainly into 2 versions reagrding where to measure the specified float distance from .......carb body cutout or gasket surface.

By the way, my PW22 IS from a 305....and therein lies most of the problem...COMMUNICATION.

What I call "gasket surface", someone else may refer to as "cutout" or "notch"

When you said "My way is for the 305 carbs and not a PW22", I'm sure you didn't mean to imply that no 305 carbs are PW22

The reason I like pics is they leave less chance for mis-interpretation.

If you look at the last pics I attached, you will see that IF the specified 26.5mm for a PW22 is measured from the cutout notch on the sides of the carb body, THEN the line of sight method DOES WORK for a PW22 carb.....at least for the 2 I have which have identical jets, holders and floats.

You will also see in the other pic, the "parallel float arm" method works IF the specified 26.5mm is measured from the very bottom "gasket surface" (the one with the semi-circle bead that seals the gasket)

These 2 different interpretations result in a 2.2mm difference in float height, and I would rather start any adjustment from the level Honda recommended, than 2.2mm off.
I do know how to set a carb float, and have done many, and not just Hondas. And it does make it much easier when you know the correct spec for float height and where the measurement reference is.

The only expertise I have found in your replies to the PW22 carb float setting question has been: "I'm not sure", or "Yep, they are different", and "Ya wrong with this one feller",.......
although I'm sure you DO know

"PEACE"

[brewsky]

Hi,

The parallel way work with both carbs, actually all older carbs from Honda build this way, because the carburettor guys designed it with a standard set of design rules. When designing a pivot this way (were the float is connected to the body), everything is in balance, wear is low, displacement is almost linear and no shear at small angles. That's why you will find in almost every Honda manual, explaining how to set the floats, the same principle and the same illustrations, check your manual, and it doesn't matter which older Honda bike it is.

I'm a very lazy guy when it comes to remembering idiot figures, data and specified distances, I like logic and generic because it's simple. Honda designers also knew the KISS rule too,

Jensen

I actually have noticed that and have used it whenever I didn't have any spec or manual to refer to.

If I have the spec available I use it, and then look to see if it makes sense.

Some models, noteably older Honda shadows, had very small changes from year to year in float height, jet sizes, air screw settings etc., so just because you have a 1995 manual, doesn't mean it can be applied to a 1996 of the same model.

The specs also provide a good check against doing something dumb, like putting the float in upside down..............not that I have EVER tried to do that!

[jensen]

Hi Brewsky,

With older Honda's I mean older Honda's, let's say to 1977 ? Above 1977 I don't know, since I don't have a bike younger then 1977 and thus no manuals to compare (well, except my XRV750, but I never opened the carbs, not necessary too, according to the dyno curves I do every 25.000 km).

Jensen

[brewsky]

Two more runs today...
tried a 130 main (didn't have a 125 avail) with needle lowered (2nd notch from top).....too rich at 3/4 and WOT.

Runs best at 120 main, mid needle position.

Tried both float levels, with the higher fuel level showing leaner mix by 0.5 at 1/4 and 1/2 throttle,
and richer mix by 0.5 at 3/4 and WOT. ????????

Will attach a spreadsheet of all runs when I figure out how....

[brewsky]

Spreadsheet attached.....

Learned a few things in the process....like how much the needle position affects the WOT ratio, at least on this carb. Also, a couple mm in float height difference can affect A/F by about 0.5 one way or another at different throttle positions.

Also the 130 main included in my Keyster rebuild kit is way too large.

Bike definately runs best at reading #6 or #3, (it is hard to feel a difference between 0.5 AFR one way or another seat of pants method)