A couple of things.
The trans of the engines has always had a problem finding neutral when running and not rolling.
We/I learned to be in neutral before stopping.
Try sitting on the bike with the engine Not Running and shift to neutral.
Ya can do it by rocking front/rear but is still difficult. (not much movement at the drum is required and the roller goes past the center of the drum location in either direction)
Clutch drag can be lessened with adjustments.
As for shifting I recommend a rider pay attention to what he wants to do.
Meaning to LIFT or PUSH DOWN like he means it.
The slack will be gone as soon as the lever is forced in either direction.
Your statement below baffles me.
<<<<I solved the issue by removing 50 % the friction area of friction discs, so that oil will disappear more quickly when disengage the clutch, thus resulting in less drag and better shifting.>>>
HONDA spent years with the clutch design to keep it from slipping.
The final result was Thicker First Plate
Dimpled Steel Plates
Redesign of the Center Area of the Center Hub and Pressure Plate
Aluminum Core Friction Disc with "Twice as Wide Friction Area"
A Spring Design which Requires More Pull but Works
At the end of production HONDA had designed a clutch which YA/I can rev the engine and dump the clutch and it will grab again and again.
I'll state that in my opinion it is far more important to have a clutch which ya don't have to replace parts in after a short time and that if ya don't get neutral before ya stop.
Be in first and hold the lever. ...................lm
jensen wrote:Hi,
I, as so many of us, had trouble with finding the neutral in the transmission. It’s not a big deal, but it is irritating and annoying especially living in suburb area’s as the Netherlands with its many roundabouts, traffic lights and traffic jams.
Not finding the neutral can have a few reasons, as there are :
Internal reasons :
- Worn transmission (like worn shift drum grooves, worn shift drum cam, weak shift stopper spring, worn shift drum pins, worn shift forks, shafts, etc).
- Worn clutch’s parts, wrong clutch adjustments.
External reason :
- Worn shift linkage (this bike acquires precise shifting, and that is almost impossible with a worn shift linkage).
- Worn clutch actuator mechanism
Engineering reasons :
- To many linkages with their necessary play, so adding up (cumulative) to an amount that even new transmissions are showing issue’s with finding the neutral (I heard this from different older people who bought these bikes new).
- Bad clutch design (probably the main reason), as Honda tried to make it better over the years with many different designs.
But, after solving all above issues, I still had issue’s with my CB72’67. This CB72’67 has the cush drive clutch, and a rebuild transmission (almost all parts are NOS). Also added a NOS clutch actuator mechanism, but still having trouble to find neutral sometimes. Precise adjusting of the clutch helps but not for long.
A few years ago I replaced the shift stopper spring for a stiffer one, and the results were positive but surely not 100 %.
The main reason for the neutral issue is the drag of the clutch, and that’s one of the reasons why Honda experimented with the clutch design (read : had lots of troubles and tried to fix it).
For good and smooth shifting it is important that the gears are not forced to transmitting power, it will increase the friction and makes shifting hard. This is one of the reasons why the clutch is needed, it disengages the power transmission between crank and transmission.
Since the neutral is between the first gear and second gear and the distances between the parts are small. If the clutch is not disengaging for 100%, friction between parts (due to force) will make you as a person apply force to the shift lever and doing so, glitch to second gear (coming from first).
It is very important that the clutch disengages for 100% otherwise one will have trouble to find neutral. When applying the clutch handle the clutch plates are forced to disengage each other, so in theory the clutch will disengage. But in between the clutch plates there is oil, and the oil introduces friction between the plates.
This is a long explanation, but oil will affect the clutch behavior, thus affecting finding neutral. In mine opinion it has nothing to do with the differences between full synthetic and mineral oils, but is has something to do with viscosity and additives and physical behavior of fluids.
To be completely independent of oil drag one could put in a dry clutch, but it seems a bit over the top on a street bike (it’s not a ducati).
I solved the issue by removing 50 % the friction area of friction discs, so that oil will disappear more quickly when disengage the clutch, thus resulting in less drag and better shifting.
Jensen
